Make Poverty History

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rossinisbird
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Make Poverty History

Post by rossinisbird » Wed Jun 29, 2005 10:02 pm

I'm sure many of you feel strongly about the huge injustice in the world, in which 50,000 people d*e every day. Most of you will have seen the ‘a child dies every three seconds’ adverts on the television and at the cinemas.

The cause is man-made – poverty. And it’s about time something was done about it.

Lots of people are heading to Edinburgh this weekend to let those at the upcoming G8 conference know that they are at the helm of a corrupt and unfair trade system which is killing people – and it needs to be stopped.

Members of South Tyneside Friends of the Earth, are going up and will also take part in the counter conference, highlighting the other big issue, climate change, and how the poorest will pay the heaviest price for the developed world’s fossil fuel lifestyle.

If you’re not going to Edinburgh you can still contribute to the campaign, and it needn’t cost you a penny. You may already have a white wristband, but to get your voice heard, just go the Make Poverty History website. Here you can send an email to Tony Blair to call on him to do something concrete about poverty. You can also take part in the Vote For Trade Justice.

It only takes ten minutes to add your voice to the millions of others shouting for a better, fairer world.

This is not about charity, it’s about giving people a fair chance, it’s about justice.

Please take part.

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Post by memor » Thu Jun 30, 2005 12:32 am

I not trying to be nasty or demean peoples attitudes to poverty.

but

The Maths don't add up.

50,000 people d*e each day. This been going on for decades.

At that rate Africa would'nt have a viable population to continue.

Why dont these charities flood Africa with condoms and help stop Aids and children they cant support.
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Post by mrp » Thu Jun 30, 2005 3:02 am

Just what do you think causes poverty?

What is trade justice?

Trade barriers hurt those who erect them most - for example, the Centre for International Economics estimated in 2004 that 90% of the benefits of the US-Australia FTA would accrue to Australia as internal and dynamic productivity improvements. Not due to acces to US markets. My interest is what effect this has on FDI however.

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Re: Make Poverty History

Post by mrp » Thu Jun 30, 2005 3:27 am

rossinisbird wrote: Lots of people are heading to Edinburgh this weekend to let those at the upcoming G8 conference know that they are at the helm of a corrupt and unfair trade system which is killing people – and it needs to be stopped.
Just how does trade kill people? Surely you do not recommend erecting more tariff and NTB's to trade?

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Post by JP » Thu Jun 30, 2005 12:27 pm

The majority of people in Africa are catholics/christians so why does'nt the vatican help out? I mean, supposedly there's billions in treasures and stuff in a room or vault or something so what I propose is that the church throw all these treasures on Ebay and give the proceeds to charity!!

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Post by brian c » Thu Jun 30, 2005 3:44 pm

People have been throwing money at Africa for 20 odd years.

What I want to know is what happened to it?

Numbered Swiss bank accounts and weapons are two highly likely options.
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Post by JP » Thu Jun 30, 2005 3:48 pm

Before we sort out Africa's problems I think Mr Geldof and co should have a look at the problems we have here such as homelessness and the like.

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Post by Alice » Thu Jun 30, 2005 4:50 pm

I agree with you there JP we need to sort our own country out first, the amount of people that are homeless here through no fault of their own.
And yes Brian they have been throwing money to Africa for year and it is still no better i cannot understand this it should have improved by now. Surely some of the money must get through to them. Or as you say Brian going into swiss bank accounts and the like. :?

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Post by Cisco » Thu Jun 30, 2005 8:06 pm

You can't help people who won't help themselves.
Africa is a bottomless pit, had money thrown at it for years and nothing changes. what happened to all the money raised last time syphoned off that's what.
There is a lot of people have a very comfortable life style out of these charity's, and they will be rubbing their hands together over this one I bet they can't believe their luck that they are getting another bite of the big cherry again.
As for condoms they won't use them as it's against their religion.
They sit there in their own filth, hungry and emaciated and can't feed their kids yet they are bonking for Africa, they must be if you believe 50,000 of them are dying every day.
I find Bob Geldof a ranting manic obsessive meglamaniac attention seeker.

We should get our own house in order first, their are starving and abused children in this country and slum estates, before we start worrying about the problems of someplace thousands of miles away. do you think if the boot was on the other foot they would help the white man, NO because they hate us, always have and always will.

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Post by brian c » Thu Jun 30, 2005 8:11 pm

If St Geldofs so concerned why doesn't he take his millions and bu**er off out to Africa and live there.
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Post by Cisco » Thu Jun 30, 2005 8:36 pm

He won't give up his luxury house with his kids going to private schools, but he expects others to do it.

hypocrites the lot of them.

Cisco

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Post by vanman188 » Thu Jun 30, 2005 9:40 pm

i love the extremely careful way rossini has described
a demonstration as a

'counter conference' :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll: :roll:

if all these demonstrators agreed with the authorities not to stage
this so called 'counter conference' then all the millions being spent
in policing them could be donated to the

'vanmans council tax charity' :wink:

lets not fluff this up but say what it really is,a demonstration that
is costing the tax payer money which could be spent in more urgent
areas of policing!
would this demonstration be taking place if st geldof had'nt
got involved?
if debt was scrapped would the public still be expected to donate to
african aid charities(more money thrown their way)
which debts are to be scrapped(medical/educational/military)?

by the way,tony blair could do somathing about my debt but chooses
not to.i'm in debt,physically can't afford to pay my rent,council tax,
electric,gas,C.S.A. & buy my kids a pressent at christmas!!!!
debt is something almost everybody around the world has but
we all manage to get by in one way or another.
are the common people of these debt ridden countries personally worse off now than they were 100 years ago?i very much doubt it!

maybe we can abolish debt owing to the u.k. if these countries would take
our assylum seeker problem off our hands!

there are also some lovely trees up there to hug rossini :)

anyway,never mind G8,i bet G4 would get a better turn out


have a nice time up there rossini
hope your conter conference is a peaceful one :wink:

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Post by memor » Fri Jul 01, 2005 12:43 am

So its agreed then.

Any money made by "Geldof ." for Live8.

should go to UK charities.

I also wondered what happened to Millions sent after last "Bandaid."

apparently it went to the local "Warlords." for guns amunition etc.
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Post by rossinisbird » Fri Jul 01, 2005 1:06 am

"What is trade justice?"

Look at the MPH website.

"My interest is what effect this has on FDI however."

As long as investors behave responsibly, why should a fairer trade system have a negative effect on fdi?

"Just how does trade k*ll people?"

I didn't say trade killed people.

"Surely you do not recommend erecting more tariff and NTB's to trade?"

Mechanisms are needed to protect developing countries until they are at a stage where they can compete fairly. Is it fair that developed countries flood developing countries with product (produced with state subsidues) at a lower price than local producers can compete with?

"The majority of people in Africa are catholics/christians so why does'nt the vatican help out?"

I don't know, ask the Pope. It should be pointed out however that many Christian (including Roman Catholic) organisations are part of the MPH campaign. Why should you let this stop you from taking part?


"Before we sort out Africa's problems I think Mr Geldof and co should have a look at the problems we have here such as homelessness and the like."

Ah, the old 'charity begins at home' bluff. So because of this morally corrupt position, you don't want to spend ten minutes to try and help stop people dying from poverty in the developing world? How noble.

Cisco. Wow. I thought madmarvin was racist. He's Mother frickin' Teresa next to you.

"i love the extremely careful way rossini has described a demonstration as a 'counter conference'"

Why, thank you. Careful as in accurate. Whilst most of your argument is obviously a poorly constructed straw man, I will try to answer your points. There is a 'counter G8' conference on the day discussing poverty issues and solutions from the environmental standpoint, but it's not part of the MPH march, but does come under the MPH umbrella. There are many other events on Saturday under the MPH banner.

"say what it really is,a demonstration that is costing the tax payer money which could be spent in more urgent areas of policing"

The G8 conference is costing the taxpayer a lot more. Perhaps you should also complain about taxpayer's money being spent on bribes for foreign politicos to get them to buy jet bombers and missile systems, or to sell off their nationalised services like health, education and water to the same crooks that are ripping us off in the UK. You could go on for hours.

Demonstration is at the heart of democracy. You don't think we should be able to get together and make our voices heard? What price do you put on the freedom of speech? (That's a rhetorical question.)

"would this demonstration be taking place if st geldof had'nt got involved?"

The MPH event was organised long before Live8. Personally, I think Live8 is a distraction from the real event on Saturday, although I am prepared to be proven wrong.

"are the common people of these debt ridden countries personally worse off now than they were 100 years ago?"

Yes. They are dying. National debt didn't exist as a concept 100 years ago for these countries. The majority of them were property of Western nations.

It seems from the misconceptions and prejudice displayed that a lot of people here have misunderstood the Make Poverty History campaign. I would suggest that you visit the website and then decide whether it's worth ten minutes of your time.

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Post by Cisco » Fri Jul 01, 2005 12:07 pm

I just don't understand the rossinibirds of this country, getting themselves worked up over people they don't know or met.
It's the Royal cow Princess Diana syndrome again where thousands of people crying and wailing over somebody they never met, that showed how weak minded and gullible most people are they showed more concern over her than they would a family member and they are been conned again here.
Did America write our debt off after the second world war, no we are still paying them, Germany did better than us after the war.
and as for that protest in Edinburgh that Geldof is shouting at people to go and protest, he should be arrested for incitement to riot.
It was on the news this morning that all the shops in Princess Street are boarding their shops up and extra police being drafted in, what's the cost of that, not counting the lost business, for a bunch of tree hugging idiots to rampage through their city.

Africans have lived like that for hundreds of years and will continue to live like that for hundreds of years to come.
We have slave labour conditions in this country, people working round the clock to make a decent wage just to pay the rent and put food on the table. Terrified to say anything in case they lost their jobs

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Post by memor » Fri Jul 01, 2005 5:05 pm

I agree Cisco.

Stopping poverty is a good thing.

So lets stop money meant for the poor and starving in the World going into corrupt officials pockets.

Lets help them grow food for themselves.

Oh and by the way. Why dont we ask Nigeria what it does with the
$100 million profits a day it makes selling oil

and put its hand in its pocket to help other African countries less fortunate than them.
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Post by tone » Fri Jul 01, 2005 5:21 pm

well said cisco couldnt have said better myself.

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Post by allan » Fri Jul 01, 2005 7:24 pm

Before you protesters go to do whatever you want to do, give a thought about the people that are leaving their homes, closing their shops, in Scotland. No I don't suppose you have even gave that any thought at all. I give to most charities, even the Sally Army. i am not giving another penny untill someone finds out where all the Millions of Pounds have went, that were given to the Tsunami Floods. The people that suffered are still suffering because they are not getting any help at all, so who has all this money, who is getting all this interest off the Millions that were donated.

Bob Geldof' What the hell is he doing with the government, if he wants to run a charity with other artists, fair enough get on with it; all I have heard' he is just like a dictator giving out orders, get off your high horse Bob and leave the politics to the politicians and get on with the music side instead of wanting to see your name splattered all over the place.

Africa, the people are dying because their government are killing them and the people that donate money to the cause are funding the African Government. It was the African Government that kicked out all the white land owners, that ran farms, businesses and such, what happened, the place is in a right hole with very few working. I agree with killing poverty, untill ours is sorted out don't go anywhere else. We must have hundreds of thousands homeless in England, pity there aint any protesters out to help these people, and I do understand a lot have been ofered accomodation, well if you can call it that, it's the pits that asylum seekers reject, still we have had this for years and probably for years to come.
There would be one thing I would like to see, The expencess sheets that all these protesters hand in when they get home.>>>> 8)

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Post by Cisco » Fri Jul 01, 2005 8:30 pm

If this government want to show they are doing something why don't they send the troops in to get rid of their corrupt governments.
He sharp sent them in to get Saddam under the pretense of weapons of mass destruction, and when he was found out to be the liar that he is, he said he had to be removed to make the world a safer place I'll tell you what, we all felt safer before all that kicked off.

Let's talk about Mugabe and what he done to the white farmers out there, killing the men raping their woman and children and burning their houses.
These were the people who were providing the food for them, now the farms have been taken over by the blacks who are to lazy to work so the machinery lies rusting in the fields. Generations of farming wiped out.
I did not see any protest marches in support of them.
Mugabe even sat beside Prince Charles at the Popes funeral and shook his hand.
People are frightened to voice their opinions over black issues because Blair has made it a criminal act to say anything about them, a yobbo could beat and rob a pensioner and get community service but call someone a black b*****d and you will go to jail.
I would toss a few of these tree huggers into one those black ghetto's in the inner city's for six months and see if he still wants to help them when he comes out.

Cisco

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Post by little_tata » Fri Jul 01, 2005 8:58 pm

Not that I have any wish to be pedantic, but you are aware that Africa is a continent which is divided into seperate countries ?

There is no "Africa Government", there are many.

As for MPH, I don't agree with the way in which Geldof has gone about it.

I believe the reason why many people don't care is simply because they do not understand.

With Live Aid, we had TV newsreels showing us the famine in Ethiopia, the babys dying in their mothers arms. Many people still associate the song Drive by the Cars with the Ethiopian Famine.

With Live 8, there are no Tv newsreels showing us the abject poverty which some still find themselves in. If there was, many more people would be willing to be more charitable.

One thing I do find interesting is the "charity begins at home" theme. I would like to know how many on this thread who are so against giving to help people out walk past the homeless in Newcastle without even seeing them?
How many blank The Big Issue sellers outside The Bridges in Sunderland and on Northumberland Street?
How many would help out their own neighbours if they knew they had no money?
How many would like nothing more than to go on a holiday to Egypt or Kenya (BOTH ARE AFRICAN COUNTRIES)?

Then again, maybe the American mentalality has finally filtered through: I'm alright so why should I care.

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